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New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel
Posted 2011-02-10 6:44 PM (#41064)
Subject: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Registration After 15.Feb. 

Here are the details which I have at this time:
  • Registration can be done by visa agencies, but they have to provide your actual address. Not yet sure if any ownership or rental documents will be required. In the beginning, probably yes.
  • You will need the original registration document. Carrying a photocopy will not be sufficient.
  • When you leave Russia, the passport control officer is supposed to take your registration document. Make sure they take it, even if they don't ask for it. De-registration is now the responsibility of the foreigner, not the inviting party.


It is yet totally unclear how this will apply to tourist/business visa's, or the consequences for failure to register/de-register.

Maybe Chris will be able to shed more light on this...???

HTH, and does not cause any confusion...  



Edited by Mel 2011-02-10 6:45 PM
Malcolm
Posted 2011-02-10 7:28 PM (#41065 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Interesting, where did you find this info?
nickomsk
Posted 2011-02-10 8:05 PM (#41066 - in reply to #41065)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Hi mel,
When is this meant to come into being?
Sorry for my lack of input of late,been a interesting 12 months, just topped that off with knee surgery yesterday.

I'm off to russia for the first time in 4 years in may, so I'm sure so much has changed.......

Nick.
Chris
Posted 2011-02-10 8:40 PM (#41067 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Location: Volgograd & Moscow
Hi

I'm not aware of anything, but I have asked the visa teams to check this out and report back.

Chris
Mel
Posted 2011-02-11 5:21 AM (#41074 - in reply to #41067)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Chris - 2011-02-11 1:40 AM Hi I'm not aware of anything, but I have asked the visa teams to check this out and report back. Chris

Chris and All,

There are several New Laws being applied early this year with direct regard to visa registration for ex-pats, insomuch, that now, no ex-pat is allowed to be registered at his/her place of work anymore, but at their residential address, this as you may understand will cause serious problems where,

1, the landlord does not wish to have anyone registered at his property, (For legal reasons).

2, the landlords will be forced to register a person or pay up to 400.000 rubles fine.

3, the landlords will have to begin paying taxes on the income, (Many not having done so in the past)

4, the landlords may also be liable for any back taxes up to 3 years...( this is unclear at this time).

Which brings us to de-registration...

The law is changing to put the owness upon the guest to DE-Register him/herself upon exiting Russia/Changing area of residence (which sould soon be automatic with the new computer system and be triggered by the new registration)...

It is because of this new computer system, that the departure of a person from Russia should trigger de-registration however, one must hand in the registration slip to the border control.....

The Govt is making it the responsibility of the guest to effect de-registration in the future......

 

Although this seems to be at this time only for certain visa types (Where business visas would be included in all probability), it is a total shambles yet again and very unclear as to what effect it will have on tourist visas....

How can the expect to work a new system but only for certain visa types..???

Hence the reason for my post last night, as soon as I was told about this new law....

Any additional enlightenment will be greatly appreciated...........

senwd
Posted 2011-02-12 12:46 AM (#41084 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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From my own situation I'd be most interested to know more about "...Registration can be done by visa agencies, but they have to provide your actual address....". Does that mean an agency in Moscow can register you at an address that is NOT in Moscow, but it IS the address at which you would be staying.

Edit: to qualify further the address is not in the Moskovskii oblast but in another oblast.

Edited by senwd 2011-02-12 12:47 AM
Chris
Posted 2011-02-12 10:33 AM (#41087 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Location: Volgograd & Moscow
We were aware of these rules last month and when reviewed them it showed the changes only applied to work visas.

We are re-checking the rules with the central UFMS in Moscow, but as of last Friday they didn't have a clue either!
Mel
Posted 2011-02-12 6:12 PM (#41099 - in reply to #41087)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Chris - 2011-02-12 3:33 PM We were aware of these rules last month and when reviewed them it showed the changes only applied to work visas. We are re-checking the rules with the central UFMS in Moscow, but as of last Friday they didn't have a clue either!

We think that you may be right on this.......

Apparantly the FMS are going to clarify this during next week and post it onto their website.....

Mel
Posted 2011-02-13 9:50 PM (#41121 - in reply to #41099)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Overhead kick back to the top of the pile............
YZF-R1
Posted 2011-02-13 10:13 PM (#41122 - in reply to #41066)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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nickomsk - 2011-02-10 8:05 PM


Sorry for my lack of input of late,been a interesting 12 months, just topped that off with knee surgery yesterday.

I'm off to russia for the first time in 4 years in may, so I'm sure so much has changed.......

Nick.


Get well soon again Nick!

Mel
Posted 2011-02-14 5:42 PM (#41130 - in reply to #41087)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Chris - 2011-02-12 3:33 PM We were aware of these rules last month and when reviewed them it showed the changes only applied to work visas. We are re-checking the rules with the central UFMS in Moscow, but as of last Friday they didn't have a clue either!

 

Your team are correct, the new rules only apply to those persons holding and working in Russia on a "Work-Visa"....

Boru
Posted 2011-02-15 11:07 AM (#41150 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: RE: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
Member

Posts: 7

Apologies for adding to any confusion. There are a vast number of rumours floating in cyber space on this issue. I'd just like to ask: 1) Do I need the original registration slip to hand in to customs when I leave? I have a scanned copy at present. I know one person who obtained his visa via the services of another company (the fool!) and he has been told to collect the original and hand it in as they are no longer responsible for deregistration?

2) Are all visas covered by this, or just work visas? Some say business visas are included, others disagree. Teaching visas and student visas are said by some to be exempt, but others say not so.

Basically, my brain hurts and I'm hoping someone has uncovered the truth.
Mel
Posted 2011-02-15 3:47 PM (#41161 - in reply to #41150)
Subject: RE: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Boru - 2011-02-15 4:07 PM Apologies for adding to any confusion. There are a vast number of rumours floating in cyber space on this issue. I'd just like to ask: 1) Do I need the original registration slip to hand in to customs when I leave? YES, and ONLY the original will be accepted... I have a scanned copy at present. I know one person who obtained his visa via the services of another company (the fool!) and he has been told to collect the original and hand it in as they are no longer responsible for deregistration? That is correct....2) Are all visas covered by this, or just work visas? Some say business visas are included, others disagree. Teaching visas and student visas are said by some to be exempt, but others say not so. Basically, my brain hurts and I'm hoping someone has uncovered the truth.

I have borrowed this info from another web site.......I cannot confirm its accuracy at this time.....

New Registration Rules for Expats

New Registration Rules for Expats to Have Mixed Effect.


New rules supposed to make expatriates' lives easier are to come into force Tuesday, but experts fear that they will actually produce new headaches.

The positive news is that foreigners will no longer be required to de-register when they leave their place of residence for more than three working days.

The Border Guard Service will automatically inform the migration authorities when a foreigner is leaving the country, and a local office of the Federal Migration Service will do the same for those who travel domestically, lawyers said Monday.

"Basically, de-registering can be deleted from expatriates' vocabulary," said Valery Fedoreyev of Baker & McKenzie's Moscow office.

The reform, spelled out in a legal alert published on the law firm's site, removes a major hassle for businesses employing foreigners, which in the past resulted in fines of up to 800,000 rubles ($27,300), when staff forgot to de-register before departure.

On the downside, the reform abolishes the current practice of registering foreigners at their employers' address.

Instead, authorities now only accept addresses that correspond with a person's real place of residence.

Consequently, landlords will have to go through long lines at post offices or Migration Service offices to register their tenants every time they return from trips longer than three working days.

Faced with complaints from foreign business associations, the Federal Migration Service agreed last week to accept registrations from third parties, if they have notarized power of attorney from the landlord.

This means landlords will be able to delegate registering foreign tenants to the employers.

Migration Service spokespeople did not answer repeated calls for comment on Monday.

But experts interviewed by The Moscow Times said that the compromise raised more questions than answers.

"What if a landlord refuses to cooperate or lives abroad?" asked one representative of a Western business association who requested anonymity because he was not authorized to speak on the record.

Most foreigners are obliged to register within three working days of arrival. Failure to produce valid registration when stopped by police may result in a fine of up to 5,000 rubles ($170)

The cumbersome registration rules have recently been relaxed for highly skilled specialists. Members of this group, defined by a 2 million ruble ($66,000) per annum minimum salary, need to register only 90 days after arrival in the country and re-register a new address only if they stay there for more than 30 days.
HTH
Boru
Posted 2011-02-15 8:12 PM (#41167 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: RE: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
Member

Posts: 7

Thanks, I saw that on the original sight. Thing is, it's still not totally clear.

Am I surprised?
Colin
Posted 2011-02-26 8:52 AM (#41357 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Landed in Moscow on Thursday, at passport control handed in my migration slip as normal. The lady then printed a new one out for me to sign with only some details and a departure date of 22/08/2014!!!! Does this mean we no longer have to fill in mirgration card before passport control?
muffy
Posted 2011-03-01 6:39 AM (#41415 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Same here landed in Moscow on Saturday, was handed a bit of paper at passport control, lets hope the 72 hour rule with obtaining registration still applies.
Colin
Posted 2011-03-01 2:13 PM (#41419 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Also no cost now to register.
Mel
Posted 2011-03-02 4:49 PM (#41430 - in reply to #41357)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Colin - 2011-02-26 1:52 PM Landed in Moscow on Thursday, at passport control handed in my migration slip as normal. The lady then printed a new one out for me to sign with only some details and a departure date of 22/08/2014!!!! Does this mean we no longer have to fill in mirgration card before passport control?

No, But it does mean that you must hand over your registration doc to the border police when you leave Russia, it is not the visitors responsibility to ensure that registration takes place correctly, and de-registration when you leave, by handing over your ORIGINAL proof doc of registration, Copies are not allowed...

HTH

Mel
Posted 2011-03-02 4:50 PM (#41431 - in reply to #41415)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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muffy - 2011-03-01 11:39 AM Same here landed in Moscow on Saturday, was handed a bit of paper at passport control, lets hope the 72 hour rule with obtaining registration still applies.

It does still apply.....

muffy
Posted 2011-03-02 6:50 PM (#41434 - in reply to #41431)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel - 2011-03-02 4:50 PM

muffy - 2011-03-01 11:39 AM Same here landed in Moscow on Saturday, was handed a bit of paper at passport control, lets hope the 72 hour rule with obtaining registration still applies.

It does still apply.....



I checked before I left and as expected no hassles when leaving Russia yesterday, next time I go over I will be using the UFMS route for registration for the first time as I have either stayed in homestay, hotels or have used Real Russia services for my past registrations.
Mel
Posted 2011-03-07 8:19 AM (#41488 - in reply to #41434)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Info for all visa holders travelling to Russia....

On entering Russia, the traveller will now find that his/her hand written migration doc will be replaced at passport control, with a printed one...  (As Muffy el-al have already experienced)


It is now the responsibility of the traveller to ensure that he/she is correctly registered within 3 working days (longer for highly qualified work visa), and and must retain the registration doc him/herself...

Upon exiting Russia, the registration doc (Original only) MUST be handed to passport control, and this process will effect correct de-registration from Russia....


Copies are not acceptable, and a fine of 5,000 rubles will be requested for non submission of the registration doc....
HTH.....

 

 



Edited by Mel 2011-03-07 8:21 AM
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-07 11:59 AM (#41493 - in reply to #41488)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Thanks for confirming this Mel. Very useful information as always You've probably just saved me from a possible 5000 RUB fine

I'm off to Russia again in a couple of weeks (on a tourist visa) and was confused about the process and which rules did or didn't apply to me. We get my tourist visas registered at the post office in my wife's home town so at least I now know that my wife's parents shouldn't keep hold of the registration slip and send it off by post after I've gone as they have previously done. As I understand it, I just need to retain the original registration slip myself and hand it to immigration control with my passport and boarding card when I am exiting Russia. At least it will save my wife's parents the postage costs to send it back themselves and the worry of it possibly going missing in the post.

Do we still actually need to fill in a hand-written migration form on the plane and hand this in at Russian immigration on entry to Russia even if it's not used? If not then why do the airlines still appear to be handing these out to people because it's just going to cause people unnecessary confusion and it's no wonder that travellers don't have a clue what they should or shouldn't be doing with migration cards and visa registration. The Russian authorities certainly aren't doing themselves or visitors to their country any favours with this confusing mess and lack of properly communicating the new rules to airlines and travellers.

Are these changes actually available in black & white anywhere for visitors to Russia to read and understand (a web page link would be useful)? It seems that even the visa agencies don't seem to know 100% what the current rules are and the slip of paper that RR sends out with newly issued tourist visas still doesn't appear to have changed since the last one I got with regards to the information about the visa registration process.

Edited by GaryM 2011-03-07 12:02 PM
muffy
Posted 2011-03-07 1:26 PM (#41495 - in reply to #41493)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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I will have a go from my understanding of the new rules. Mel feel free to call me a numpty if I get it wrong.

GaryM - 2011-03-07 11:59 AM

Thanks for confirming this Mel. Very useful information as always You've probably just saved me from a possible 5000 RUB fine

I'm off to Russia again in a couple of weeks (on a tourist visa) and was confused about the process and which rules did or didn't apply to me. We get my tourist visas registered at the post office in my wife's home town so at least I now know that my wife's parents shouldn't keep hold of the registration slip and send it off by post after I've gone as they have previously done. As I understand it, I just need to retain the original registration slip myself and hand it to immigration control with my passport and boarding card when I am exiting Russia. At least it will save my wife's parents the postage costs to send it back themselves and the worry of it possibly going missing in the post.



Yes I think this is the case now, I used to use Real Russia for registration but will now use the post office/UFMS route to save a trip to the centre of Moscow


Do we still actually need to fill in a hand-written migration form on the plane and hand this in at Russian immigration on entry to Russia even if it's not used? If not then why do the airlines still appear to be handing these out to people because it's just going to cause people unnecessary confusion and it's no wonder that travellers don't have a clue what they should or shouldn't be doing with migration cards and visa registration. The Russian authorities certainly aren't doing themselves or visitors to their country any favours with this confusing mess and lack of properly communicating the new rules to airlines and travellers.



No you don't, BMI certainly are up to speed with the new regulations on the flight I was on


Are these changes actually available in black & white anywhere for visitors to Russia to read and understand (a web page link would be useful)? It seems that even the visa agencies don't seem to know 100% what the current rules are and the slip of paper that RR sends out with newly issued tourist visas still doesn't appear to have changed since the last one I got with regards to the information about the visa registration process.


Not sure about this one, I know Real Russia updated there site a few days ago with the new process for registration.
Mel
Posted 2011-03-08 5:59 AM (#41519 - in reply to #41495)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Muffy,

I think that you are correct....

I would however suggest, that for the time being, that one should still fill out the migration slip, and hand it in with/have it available when giving over the passport, just in case.......

I believe that RR can still register visitors, but they will need to go to the RR office to collect the original doc before exiting Russia...

Maybe Chris can add his knowledge to this.......

Its still all a little bit higgeldepiggeldy and unclear as usual with Russia....

muffy
Posted 2011-03-08 8:46 AM (#41522 - in reply to #41519)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel - 2011-03-08 5:59 AM

Muffy,

I think that you are correct....

I would however suggest, that for the time being, that one should still fill out the migration slip, and hand it in with/have it available when giving over the passport, just in case.......





In my case which was in Domodedovo none were available on the plane and certainly none on view near the passport control booths.

Mel - 2011-03-08 5:59 AM

I believe that RR can still register visitors, but they will need to go to the RR office to collect the original doc before exiting Russia...

Maybe Chris can add his knowledge to this.......

Its still all a little bit higgeldepiggeldy and unclear as usual with Russia....



You are right here Mel as long as you can get the original document to you before you leave Russia you can still register with Real Russia. As mentioned before I had been using them for a while and had even bought a printer scanner for my fiance to be able to avoid the trip to the office but as I go slightly outside Moscow, I will be using another registration route from now on(which is most certainly not a reflection on the excellent service I get from Real Russia).
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