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New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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GaryM
Posted 2011-03-08 8:47 PM (#41563 - in reply to #41522)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Neil, can you confirm that when you get handed the printed migration card to sign, I assume you sign 2 copies (like with the manual one) and then get given one of them to keep so you can use for the registration process as per usual?
muffy
Posted 2011-03-08 9:35 PM (#41564 - in reply to #41563)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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GaryM - 2011-03-08 8:47 PM

Neil, can you confirm that when you get handed the printed migration card to sign, I assume you sign 2 copies (like with the manual one) and then get given one of them to keep so you can use for the registration process as per usual?


Yes its exactly the same piece of paper as the manual one, you sign both as before and they then hand one of them back to you.
Mel
Posted 2011-03-14 11:54 AM (#41652 - in reply to #41522)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Hot off the press today.....

Foreigner Bill Sails Through Duma
The Moscow Times, 14 March 2011

The State Duma waved through an amendment Friday that eases registration rules for foreigners, passing the new law in both a second and third reading, the parliament said on its web site.

The readings passed with 410 and 404 votes in favor, respectively, the Duma said ,. No information about votes against or abstentions was given.

The new rules say foreigners only have to register seven, not three, working days after arrival in the country, thus removing a lot of red tape for businessmen and tourists.

They also return the responsibility for registering foreigners working in the country to employers, doing away with a February reform that has made it the job of private landlords.

Last month's reform caused an influx of complaints from foreign businesses because many landlords refused to register their tenants or even authorize foreigners' employers to handle the registration.

The amendment, which was initiated by the Constitution and State Affairs Committee after meetings with foreign business associations last month, should come into force on March 31, the Rosbalt.ru news agency reported.
Again as clear as mud really...
Maybe Chris has the answer.
HTH
muffy
Posted 2011-03-15 11:01 AM (#41670 - in reply to #41652)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel - 2011-03-14 11:54 AM

Hot off the press today.....

Foreigner Bill Sails Through Duma
The Moscow Times, 14 March 2011

The State Duma waved through an amendment Friday that eases registration rules for foreigners, passing the new law in both a second and third reading, the parliament said on its web site.

The readings passed with 410 and 404 votes in favor, respectively, the Duma said ,. No information about votes against or abstentions was given.

The new rules say foreigners only have to register seven, not three, working days after arrival in the country, thus removing a lot of red tape for businessmen and tourists.

They also return the responsibility for registering foreigners working in the country to employers, doing away with a February reform that has made it the job of private landlords.

Last month's reform caused an influx of complaints from foreign businesses because many landlords refused to register their tenants or even authorize foreigners' employers to handle the registration.

The amendment, which was initiated by the Constitution and State Affairs Committee after meetings with foreign business associations last month, should come into force on March 31, the Rosbalt.ru news agency reported.
Again as clear as mud really...
Maybe Chris has the answer.
HTH


Sounds like a right farce, will be registering as usual during my next week long visit during the Royal Wedding even though I may not need to.
mym
Posted 2011-03-15 11:53 AM (#41672 - in reply to #41652)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel - 2011-03-14 11:54 AM
The new rules say foreigners only have to register seven, not three, working days after arrival in the country, thus removing a lot of red tape for businessmen and tourists.


My god, that would be useful...
mym
Posted 2011-03-15 12:30 PM (#41674 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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The interesting part of the Amendment seems to be this bit:

in The Federal Law of 18 July 2006 № 109-FZ "On Migration Registration of Foreign Citizens and Stateless Persons in the Russian Federation "(Collected Legislation of the Russian Federation, 2006, № 30, Art. 3285, 2007, № 49, Art. 6071, 2008, № 30, Art. 3589, 3616, 2009, № 29, Art. 3636, 2010, № 52, Art. 7000) the following changes:

....

2) In Article 20:
a) in the first subparagraph of paragraph 2 of Part 2, the word "three" with the word "seven";
b) in paragraph 2 of Part 3 of the word "three" with the word "seven";
c) in Part 4 of a word "three" with the word "seven";
d) in paragraph 5 of Part 6, the word "three" with the word "seven";

mym
Posted 2011-03-15 12:50 PM (#41675 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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As far as I can make out that means that anyone in a hotel will still be registered on arrival there, but everyone else has 7 days not three.
The relevant part of the law will now read as follows:

Chapter 4. Registration of foreign citizens in the place of residence

Article 20. Compulsory registration of foreign citizens in the place of residence

....

2) a foreign citizen temporarily residing or temporarily staying in the Russian Federation - [must be registered] after seven working days from the date of arrival at the residence, except when specified foreign citizen:

a) is located in a hotel or other organization that provides hotel services in a sanatorium, rest home, boarding house, campsite, children's summer camp, hospital or other health care facility or social services;

b) is in an institution for the rehabilitation of persons with no fixed abode;

c) is in the institutions executing criminal or administrative punishment.

3. In the cases contemplated in ... sub paragraphs "a" - "c" of Part 2 of this Article, the receiving party shall, within one day notify the body of migration of the registration of the foreign citizen.



(source http://yav.org.ru/laws/migration/migruchet.htm)
scampypants
Posted 2011-03-17 4:43 AM (#41731 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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I have a question, sorry if it is a little silly.

I registered as normal in the post office but this time i didnt have to make a payment at the bank to the UFMS do i have to make a payment on leaving the country ? or should i have made the payment at the bank they told me they do not accept payments anymore for this service. I fully understand its my responsibility to deregister at passport control when leaving the country.
wiz
Posted 2011-03-17 8:29 AM (#41732 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: RE: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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No More Police Fines for Incorrect Registration Papers


Police will no longer be allowed to collect fines from foreigners with invalid or missing registration papers, according to a bill aimed at easing registration rules that was approved by the Federation Council on Wednesday.

Instead, the party that issued the foreigner's visa invitation will be held responsible for violations.

"The bill stipulates that the inviting party, usually the employer, is responsible for any such violation," said Vladimir Kobzev, head of the legal department of the Russo-German Chamber of Commerce.

He said employers should inform their foreign staff to always carry valid registration to avoid fines being slapped on the company, which can be as high as 500,000 rubles ($17,500).

The hitherto little-publicized detail in the registration legislation is supposed to reduce extortion, "because a police officer can no longer demand money directly on the street," Kobzev said.

The main thrust of the bill is to ease registration rules by lengthening the period foreigners can be in the country without notifying authorities, from three to seven working days. It also abolishes a recent reform requiring landlords to register foreign tenants at their factual addresses, reinstating the previous rule of registering at the employers' address.

Read more : http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/no-more-police-fines-for...
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-17 12:26 PM (#41739 - in reply to #41731)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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scampypants - 2011-03-17 4:43 AM

I registered as normal in the post office but this time i didnt have to make a payment at the bank to the UFMS do i have to make a payment on leaving the country ? or should i have made the payment at the bank they told me they do not accept payments anymore for this service. I fully understand its my responsibility to deregister at passport control when leaving the country.

When that requirement came in last year (to make payment to the UFMS at a Sperbank), you had to submit the payment receipt with the registration form at the post office as proof of the payment having been made. They wouldn't accept the registration form without that payment proof.

If they've accepted yours without you providing such a receipt then it suggests that the requirement has either been dropped again or they were a bit slack in doing the pre-registration checks. I'll be able to find out when I go over there next week so I'll post back afterwards.

Either way, I don't think you'll need to pay anything more now.

Out of interest, how much did the post office charge you?
Mel
Posted 2011-03-17 4:21 PM (#41748 - in reply to #41732)
Subject: RE: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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wiz - 2011-03-17 1:29 PM No More Police Fines for Incorrect Registration Papers Police will no longer be allowed to collect fines from foreigners with invalid or missing registration papers, according to a bill aimed at easing registration rules that was approved by the Federation Council on Wednesday. Instead, the party that issued the foreigner's visa invitation will be held responsible for violations. "The bill stipulates that the inviting party, usually the employer, is responsible for any such violation," said Vladimir Kobzev, head of the legal department of the Russo-German Chamber of Commerce. He said employers should inform their foreign staff to always carry valid registration to avoid fines being slapped on the company, which can be as high as 500,000 rubles ($17,500). The hitherto little-publicized detail in the registration legislation is supposed to reduce extortion, "because a police officer can no longer demand money directly on the street," Kobzev said. The main thrust of the bill is to ease registration rules by lengthening the period foreigners can be in the country without notifying authorities, from three to seven working days. It also abolishes a recent reform requiring landlords to register foreign tenants at their factual addresses, reinstating the previous rule of registering at the employers' address. Read more : http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/no-more-police-fines-for-incorrect-registration-papers/432702.html[/QUOTE]

Whilst the gist of this statement is correct, it only referrs to those living and working in Russia for a Russian Company, or and overseas subsidery Company, and does NOT referr to those visiting Russia on either a Business, Visitors, or Invitation Visa....
Please be best advised to register in the correct manner, and always carry your valid docs with you at all times to avoid any problems with any Russian Officials...
Please also be advised, that should ANYONE demand money in any way or form, you should refuse to pay, and request instead, an administrative Spravka, which you should take to a Russian Lawyer, who will solve this problem for you quickly.....Usually with a phone call...
HTH

Mel
Posted 2011-03-17 4:31 PM (#41750 - in reply to #41739)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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GaryM - 2011-03-17 5:26 PM
scampypants - 2011-03-17 4:43 AM I registered as normal in the post office but this time i didnt have to make a payment at the bank to the UFMS do i have to make a payment on leaving the country ? or should i have made the payment at the bank they told me they do not accept payments anymore for this service. I fully understand its my responsibility to deregister at passport control when leaving the country.
When that requirement came in last year (to make payment to the UFMS at a Sperbank), you had to submit the payment receipt with the registration form at the post office as proof of the payment having been made. They wouldn't accept the registration form without that payment proof. If they've accepted yours without you providing such a receipt then it suggests that the requirement has either been dropped again or they were a bit slack in doing the pre-registration checks. I'll be able to find out when I go over there next week so I'll post back afterwards. Either way, I don't think you'll need to pay anything more now. Out of interest, how much did the post office charge you?

 

Gary,

I have read about such charge in previous posts, and have always challenged it.....

Travelling to Russia now for many more years than I care to remember, I have always registered at the local Ovir, and have NEVER been charged a penny, so I would suggest that the Post Offices have been making an illegal charge....

It is in Russian law somewhere, that there is NO charge for registration, so you will be well within your rights to refuse to make any form of payment for the service.......

I think that I read that the charge was about 200 roubles, or a small sum set in relation to how many days the person would be staying in Russia........

Please also remember, that these new laws are really being designed around the problems attached to registration for foreign workers in Russia, and are as such, still as clear as MUD, so I would reccomend that any visitor, if only for the time being untill total clarity prevails, sticks to the OLD 3 day rule, and registers them selves correctly.....

The change that you should be aware of, which is now also in practice, is that when you leave Russia, you are responsible for handing your registration doc to the Border guards/passport control, as this is the new way to de-register all visitors, be aware that this must be the original doc, and not a p/copy....

HTH

scampypants
Posted 2011-03-18 9:41 AM (#41777 - in reply to #41739)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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GaryM - 2011-03-17 12:26 PM

scampypants - 2011-03-17 4:43 AM

I registered as normal in the post office but this time i didnt have to make a payment at the bank to the UFMS do i have to make a payment on leaving the country ? or should i have made the payment at the bank they told me they do not accept payments anymore for this service. I fully understand its my responsibility to deregister at passport control when leaving the country.

When that requirement came in last year (to make payment to the UFMS at a Sperbank), you had to submit the payment receipt with the registration form at the post office as proof of the payment having been made. They wouldn't accept the registration form without that payment proof.

If they've accepted yours without you providing such a receipt then it suggests that the requirement has either been dropped again or they were a bit slack in doing the pre-registration checks. I'll be able to find out when I go over there next week so I'll post back afterwards.

Either way, I don't think you'll need to pay anything more now.

Out of interest, how much did the post office charge you?


I have paid at the spermbank on my last three visits and as you said they wouldnt accept the forms without the receipt. They told me in the bank and at the post office that i didnt need to pay anymore there but im just interested to see if i will be made to pay on exit for the days that i have stayed.

The cost at the post office has risen last time it was 118 rb but this time it was 184. but its just the cost of sending the forms not a 'payment for registering' like it would cost to send a letter by royal mail.
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-18 10:48 AM (#41778 - in reply to #41777)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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scampypants - 2011-03-18 9:41 AM

I have paid at the spermbank on my last three visits and as you said they wouldnt accept the forms without the receipt. They told me in the bank and at the post office that i didnt need to pay anymore there but im just interested to see if i will be made to pay on exit for the days that i have stayed.

The cost at the post office has risen last time it was 118 rb but this time it was 184. but its just the cost of sending the forms not a 'payment for registering' like it would cost to send a letter by royal mail.

Yes that's what I understood...just a cost for posting off the registration forms to wherever they get sent to. It used to cost more at the post office (around £7-8 IIRC) but that was before they then transferred the "registration payment" to the Sperbank last year.

I wonder if this "no more registration charge" is a regional thing or not. My wife is in the SPb region at the moment so I'll ask her to try and go to the post office and ask so I know before I arrive over there next week what the score is. If they no longer charge then it would make our lives much easier because we can get me registered using the post office in the airport on arrival like we use to do before the Sperbank payment requirement was introduced.

I would be very surprised if you will have to pay anything on exit. If they started doing that then it would turn into an administrative nightmare with immigration officers having to take a payment from every visitor on their way back out of Russia. Not to mention that it would seriously hold up the queue of people trying to get through immigration control.
Colin
Posted 2011-03-19 9:40 AM (#41817 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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No payment needed now, no payment was printed across the slip I was handed at passport control in Moscow. Makes it a lot quicker to register.
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-21 12:08 AM (#41843 - in reply to #41817)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Thanks Colin. I can now confirm this too. My wife went into the post office on Saturday and asked about payment at the Sperbank and they told her it's no longer needed. So no more registration payment Will make life much easier with just a visit to the post office to register and then simply handing the registration slip to immigration control on the way back out of Russia.
nickomsk
Posted 2011-03-23 4:47 PM (#41898 - in reply to #41843)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Hi All,sorry for my long silence


Just wondering if the registration process will be the same for me in Omsk????

Just taken delivery of my visa to visit Russia in May,for the first time my visa came with a letter saying the registration process in certain restricted cities was slightly different or more complicated!!!!!!!!Its now saying Omsk is a restricted city........

Having been to Omsk on many occasions ( though to be said not for 4 years) ive never had a problem in regards to being registered correctly,the last time it was done at the post office.....

So do i just do as normal, go to the post office and register with the owner of the property where we are staying??

All your comments will be greatly received.......

Many thanks

Nick.
Mel
Posted 2011-03-23 5:06 PM (#41899 - in reply to #41898)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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nickomsk - 2011-03-23 9:47 PM Hi All,sorry for my long silence Just wondering if the registration process will be the same for me in Omsk???? Just taken delivery of my visa to visit Russia in May,for the first time my visa came with a letter saying the registration process in certain restricted cities was slightly different or more complicated!!!!!!!!Its now saying Omsk is a restricted city........ Having been to Omsk on many occasions ( though to be said not for 4 years) ive never had a problem in regards to being registered correctly,the last time it was done at the post office..... So do i just do as normal, go to the post office and register with the owner of the property where we are staying?? All your comments will be greatly received....... Many thanks Nick.

Not 100% certain on this question Nick, but I think that you also have to have an Itinery as well for Omsk...

Suggest that you ask Chris, he will know I'm sure....

HTH

nickomsk
Posted 2011-03-23 5:25 PM (#41906 - in reply to #41899)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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CHRIS.........HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-24 10:52 AM (#41923 - in reply to #41564)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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muffy - 2011-03-08 9:35 PM

GaryM - 2011-03-08 8:47 PM

Neil, can you confirm that when you get handed the printed migration card to sign, I assume you sign 2 copies (like with the manual one) and then get given one of them to keep so you can use for the registration process as per usual?


Yes its exactly the same piece of paper as the manual one, you sign both as before and they then hand one of them back to you.

Well, I flew into St Petersburg (Pulkovo) airport yesterday and on the plane (Rossiya Airlines) they just handed out the manual migration forms as per usual. I filled it in anyway on the assumption that I would get handed a printed one back to sign at immigration control but they just did the usual and stamped my manual one then handed the "departure" part back to me. So it seems that nothing has changed on that side of things, certainly not in SPb anyway. Maybe they just don't have the technology installed yet or maybe they just intend to continue using the manually filled in forms (???).

I just hope they've adopted the new "deregister yourself" procedure because if they give me a strange look as I try to hand them the registration slip at immigration control on the way back out then I will be in trouble because I won't then be able to give it back to my host to de-register me
Mel
Posted 2011-03-24 6:06 PM (#41931 - in reply to #41923)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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GaryM - 2011-03-24 3:52 PM
muffy - 2011-03-08 9:35 PM
GaryM - 2011-03-08 8:47 PM Neil, can you confirm that when you get handed the printed migration card to sign, I assume you sign 2 copies (like with the manual one) and then get given one of them to keep so you can use for the registration process as per usual?
Yes its exactly the same piece of paper as the manual one, you sign both as before and they then hand one of them back to you.
Well, I flew into St Petersburg (Pulkovo) airport yesterday and on the plane (Rossiya Airlines) they just handed out the manual migration forms as per usual. I filled it in anyway on the assumption that I would get handed a printed one back to sign at immigration control but they just did the usual and stamped my manual one then handed the "departure" part back to me. So it seems that nothing has changed on that side of things, certainly not in SPb anyway. Maybe they just don't have the technology installed yet or maybe they just intend to continue using the manually filled in forms (???). I just hope they've adopted the new "deregister yourself" procedure because if they give me a strange look as I try to hand them the registration slip at immigration control on the way back out then I will be in trouble because I won't then be able to give it back to my host to de-register me

Am told that the system is delayed at Pulkovo, but should be operational within the next couple of months...

Just ensure that you do hand in the registration doc, as this is now Russian law....They must accept it......

HTH

nickomsk
Posted 2011-03-26 7:01 AM (#41952 - in reply to #41931)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011


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Thats about as clear as mud now then..............
GaryM
Posted 2011-03-26 8:45 AM (#41953 - in reply to #41931)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Mel - 2011-03-24 6:06 PM

Am told that the system is delayed at Pulkovo, but should be operational within the next couple of months...

Just ensure that you do hand in the registration doc, as this is now Russian law....They must accept it......

HTH

Thanks Mel.

We registered my visa at the post office yesterday and surprisingly they did seem to know that the slips should now be handed back in at immigration control by myself on the way out of Russia although they did also say we could still just send it off as previously if we preferred to. Maybe there is a period of "crossover" where they will accept both de-registration methods until everyone knows 100% what the new procedure is. Either way, I'll definitely be handing the registration slip in myself at the airport
yoah
Posted 2011-03-26 5:10 PM (#41965 - in reply to #41064)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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I arrived in Russia on 16th March. As we were staying in Moscow for a few days, for Elena to take her KET tests and for me to go to the British Embassy, I was registered in Moscow itself. On the BMI flight in, we weren't actually told about the 'autoomatic' immigration card completions so I had to ask. On entering Russia, I was given one half of the immigration slip. Now I have registered in Bryansk (tried the Post Office but they couldn't register!!) and will take the latest registration slip, a photocopy of the one from Moscow, and my immigration slip to the airport when I fly back next week.

As an aside, I had quite a interesting visit to the British Embassy. I was hoping to apply for our daughter's UK Passport & Birth Certificate in our married name but, as her Russian Birth certificate is in my wife's maiden name, both documents had to be applied for in the maiden name. Am I missing something here??







Edited by yoah 2011-03-26 5:12 PM
GaryM
Posted 2011-04-01 7:14 AM (#42084 - in reply to #41953)
Subject: Re: New registration rules in Russia from 15-02-2011
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Well I've just come through immigration control at Pulkovo airport with registration slip in hand as per the new rules and they didn't want anything to do with it and refused to take it. So now I'm left with a registration slip and will not be deregistered.

All I can do now is send it back to Russia when I'm back in the UK but it obviously won't back to Russia in the 3 days or whatever the time limit is to de-register. I just hope my hosts don't get fined.

What a complete shambles this whole registration system is. Clearly no-one here has any clue whatsoever The Russian authorities need to get a grip and sort this complete mess out.
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